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correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

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correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon shade whitesel » Donnerstag 8. Dezember 2011, 03:24

After years of doing this with a reward of a bite from the helper, even the dog with the most correct distance will start to crowd the helper, going towards his reinforcement. I have read about using a ball from the helper for that exact reason, never letting the dog bite in the blind, etc....
And there is probably no good answer.
I have a dog that is very clean and correct in the blind, but he is starting to get closer and closer to the helper, and his chin sometimes hits the sleeve. I do not have a problem yet, but in a year, I anticipate it...?
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon Katrin + Kerou » Freitag 9. Dezember 2011, 02:04

Yesterday, i sent her two videos from my dog. Heuwinkl/Knut Fuchs Methode. But perhaps, sombody else has another ideas for her dog?

I'll try to explain.

You send the dog to the helper in the blind.
You can also put yourself in the hideout. If the dog comes to you and barks you throw the arm.
Sometimes, after barking once, another time barking after 10 times.
Let him learn that he must never bite in hiding.
The bark is also open and free, when the dog barks because he expects a throw of the arm.

The helper through the arm only from the blind away, not when he is standing in the field.

Video from Knut Fuchs Seminar. He trains that like Team Heuwinkl.




I have a slow ,,aus,, then the dog should hold the helper. When I say ,, aus,, (faster/shorter) and with a little bit aggression then it's like in the video and the dog should bark and show aggression.

So, ,,auuuus,, = hold the helper
,,auß,,! = hold and barking

Here you can see that a little bit.



Then I have these exercises.

For example i got to the blind. Dog looks at me and i send him to the helper. He barks good, then the helper can through the arm away or i giv a command ,, here, fuß,, and when that is good, i send him again to the helper ( it is like a reward for him that he can bark again)

Another idea. Do you know the circle system?
You can use it at the blind.

I hope that there is not so much rain tomorrow, then i will make a video fro you. Ok?


At 2:56 you can see my circle training. I have no helper so i use a tree :-) But i make a new video for you. Better quality and with all the exercises.






I think, you can ask Maria ( dino is her name in the forum). She trains like Heuwinkl with her dogs. Perhaps she has a better video.
In germany it is raining and raining and raining ...
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon Katrin + Kerou » Freitag 9. Dezember 2011, 02:09

This is very interesting, too.



They train that in obedience and not in part C. Later in part C, but not when the dog should learn what to do with it.
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon Katrin + Kerou » Freitag 9. Dezember 2011, 02:22

I found something about heuwinkl.

I will translate for you.

Initially trained with a ball or food etc..
The helper is in the blind and holds like later the helpers ( half bent arm) the ball in the left hand. If the dog barks, the ball is thrown to the right.

Reason: to ensure that the dog barks in the middle and not on the left arm stays.

Later you use a small arm or a beißkissen ( http://www.frabo.de/schutzaermel/beisskissen/index.html )
and you through it like the food, the ball away.

This is the Heuwinkl Training for barking in the blind.

I am sorry, it is late now. I will write more tomorrow. Ok?

More about barking in the field, ,, aus,, etc tomorrow :-) I am very tired now. It is 2:23 in the morning ... bye
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon DenniK » Freitag 9. Dezember 2011, 07:30

versteck = blind
:schlaumeier:

I will change that in katrins text. by bolleboxer ;)
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon Katrin + Kerou » Samstag 10. Dezember 2011, 02:12

DenniK hat geschrieben:versteck = blind
:schlaumeier:

I will change that in katrins text. by bolleboxer ;)



Ich weiß, dass es so heißt. Es hatte schon einen Grund, warum ich ,, versteck,, geschrieben habe.
Egal. Ich erkläre es einafch weiter per PN.

Sprechen all die anderen hier kein english?

So jemand nettes fragt um Rat und niemand antwortet.?


in english, because it is the english corner.

i know that blind means ,, versteck,,. But there is a reason, that i wrote ,, versteck,,.
Is there nobody, who speaks english?

Such a nice person aks for help and no one answers?
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon Katrin + Kerou » Samstag 10. Dezember 2011, 02:17

Have you tried the Heuwinkl training?

I will have a look, if i can more videos and reports about heuwinkl or Knut Fuchs and the circle systhem.

Today it has rained and it's still raining :steinigung: :ertrink:
If it is not raining, you get the video ;-)

wetter.com says it's raining until next week Thursday :ertrink: :cry:

@ all

Hat jemand ein Video vom Kreissystem am Versteck oder auf dem Platz?
Und vllt eines bzgl dem Verbellen der Heuwinkl/ Knut Fuchs Methode?
Katrin + Kerou
 

Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon dberensmann » Samstag 10. Dezember 2011, 09:02

Katrin + Kerou hat geschrieben:Ich weiß, dass es so heißt. Es hatte schon einen Grund, warum ich ,,versteck,, geschrieben habe.

:stupid: .... wonder what this could be?

@ shade
.... if you want a dog beging for the sleeve or bite pillow go ahead and try out one of the possibilities above. :nein:
.... if you still want to train your dog on a national level, keep doing what you did and just let your dog know that there is no way for him to get to close to the sleeve without you having him punished. after all you can ask "Les Flores" about what would be the best to do in order to keep your dog clean!
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Mehr Informationen & praktische Beispiele gibt es auf meinem IPO Video Training Blog
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon bolleboxer » Samstag 10. Dezember 2011, 09:49

Okay, I try it to write in english.... :ertrink:

My way to teach my dog barking in the blind is like "Glöckner" (Klaus Glöckner), he wrote a booklet how about the nonviolent way to teach barking, but I think it's only in german.

In this video the dog is 5 month old and learns barking like Glöckner. (Glöckner do not use clicker, but it is the same way)



The way is not to bite in the blind. The "click" is the order for the helper to throw the toy away. Heuwinkl/Fuchs are using a special biting arm for throwing away -> "Wurfarm" http://www.haleico.de/sport-und-ausbildung/schutzdienst/knut-fuchs-wurfarm-jute-44282?sAction=index The opinion is that the dog also mustn't have to bite in the blind when he gets testing.
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Re: correct distance from the helper in the blind ?

Beitragvon Blue Luna » Samstag 10. Dezember 2011, 16:39

Katrin + Kerou hat geschrieben:Ich weiß, dass es so heißt. Es hatte schon einen Grund, warum ich ,,versteck,, geschrieben habe.

Could you explain that? :gruebel:
Why have you used the German word?

dberensmann hat geschrieben:.... if you want a dog beging for the sleeve or bite pillow go ahead and try out one of the possibilities above. :nein:

Detlef, do you want to doubt that the method of Glöckner, Heuwinkl or Fuchs really works on a national level?
I think, all of them have already proved the efficiency of that method.

dberensmann hat geschrieben:.... if you still want to train your dog on a national level, keep doing what you did and just let your dog know that there is no way for him to get to close to the sleeve without you having him punished. after all you can ask "Les Flores" about what would be the best to do in order to keep your dog clean!

You want her to punish her dog? Have I understood you right?
And who is "Les Flores"?
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